Katy Milkman || How to Change

May 13, 2021

Katy Milkman is an award-winning behavioral scientist and the James G. Dinan Professor
at The Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania. She hosts Charles Schwab’s
popular behavioral economics podcast Choiceology, and is the co-founder and co-director of The Behavior Change for Good Initiative. She has worked with or advised dozens of organizations on how to spur positive change, including Google, the U.S. Department of Defense, the American Red Cross, 24 Hour Fitness, Walmart and Morningstar. Her research is regularly featured in major media outlets such as The New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, and NPR.


[1:33] What it means to align one’s actions with their goals and dreams

[2:41] Why change is difficult

[6:51] Katy’s thoughts on the barrier of conformity

[8:37] Katy discusses laziness

[12:20] The power of elastic habits

[21:09] How to avoid flaking out

[29:01] How to create a fresh start

[39:21] Why a fresh start can be a setback to some

[45:06] What “temptation-bundling” is

[48:33] Katy’s thoughts on self-control

[51:14] How the power of social forces can boost self-control

[54:15] Can positive behavioral interventions create meaningful change?

[56:12] Does age have an impact on the ability to change?

[58:46] When should we seek change vs. self-acceptance?

[1:02:26] What behavioral changes make a better academic?

3 Responses to “Katy Milkman || How to Change”

  1. Justin Dillree says:

    Scott, you seemed so far out from Katy’s message in this episode! I really think that what she had to say meets the needs of the masses. I hope the next time she is on your show it’s much more harmonious.

  2. Lexus Wesley says:


    I have been following your account for a year now as well as your Twitter and find more and more aspirational as time goes by. Mindful Healing Foundation, inc. is a nonprofit in the process of being approved by the IRS to become tax exempt. Our mission as a nonprofit is guide, equip, empower and provide the ability for individuals to be able to afford to see therapists. The Mindful Healing Foundation, Inc. endeavors to allow individuals with financial help to be able to get the service they need to improve their mental health. We are also going to be funding a volunteer based program called “The Buddy App” that is going to structured as a discreet buddy system for people who need someone to just listen to their daily stress and comfort. It’s all a big process to fund but I’m hoping by the time I graduate with my doctorates in psychology (I have a long way to go since I’m just a junior in college) that the nonprofit will be able to fully help millions of people be able to afford therapy and also have this app that brings people close.

    I can’t wait to listen to more insightful conversations with you and other professions

    Lexus Wesley
    President/Founder of Mindful Healing Foundation

  3. Dianne Wright says:

    I think it sounds like a great idea to have a “buddy” app!

Join the Discussion